The issue with those who had represented themselves before God and man as being in a place of spiritual authority with the responsibility to be above reproach often have escaped civil or criminal conviction or any sort of permanent admission of guilt or shortcoming for which repentance is called. And conveniently you are dismissing the affair. Though Lynne had intended to become a social worker, she did not hesitate to commit her life to church ministry, convinced that God has given the local church a clear mandate to address the needs of "the whole person in the whole world." As it has been stated in widening circles of social media, under these circumstances (such as: improper investigation, witness discounting/tampering/intemadation, and most important lack of following scriptural guidelines) the Willow Creek 501(c)3 church organization by many credible voices has been deemed/proscribed as no longer a(n) safe or scriptural place to attend or be a part of. I read it Daily and Journal too. The news of the divorce came as a shock to many, as the couple had always seemed to have a strong and healthy relationship. If you all think that personal shopping is sex abuse, you need to get real. John Ortberg served (1994-2003) as teaching pastor at Chicagos Willow Creek Community Church. No one walks away unascathed. Lets pretend we know what we are doing., When someone shows you who they are believe them; the first time. Maya Angelou. Nothing really bad happened. he did so because there were problems and he knew more would come. Christian vs. Jew This sounds like the guys in the NHL who put black marks on their helmets when they get hit with puck. Followed by the disciples, who never promoted themselves, built buildings, staged shows, had followers, had a staff. Got to stop that! Take responsibility for your actions and the role you played! This fact is well known to those who are around sexual abuse/misconduct situations. Thanks for the info. The issue with those who had represented themselves before God and man as being in a place of spiritual authority with the responsibility tojudgment were made public spin). Im thinking of 2 comments right now from over a year ago in which you reposted comments you attempted to post elsewhere. But at church with people you see week after week? All the retreats, big brother making sure you attend mid week activities (I know of some megas that were playing around with a card swipe for staff to make sure they were attending services and staying), the need to be cool, your personal assistants doing your clothes shopping, etc, etc. If you all think that personal shopping is sex abuse, you need to get real. I looked down at the author. @ dee: Dee, I leave all matters of *who is and who is not a real Christian* In the capable hands of the One who has a higher pay grade. Thus, the cottage industry that often accompanies or is an integral part of their ministry (sic) glides on, and the supposed spiritual.authority who is moving on is positioned to escape consequences and true rebuke. Wherever my story takes me, however dark and difficult the theme, there is always some hope and redemption, not because readers like happy endings, but because I am an optimist at heart. Having Church in your club title does not necessarily mean it is the Bride of Christ. You are right, the whole situation smells of cover-up. I suspect one does not not from creepy hugs, but research shows it is true in more ambivalent hugs, or hugs where someone is already inclined to have even a small degree of trust (e.g. WC is Hybels no matter how much they protest. Make an Example of one, and a hundred will fall right into line, bleating praises. Wonder who taught Billy to dress like a leader. Because my -and others- comments are moderated, there can be a lot of instantly-posted discussion between a (approval-needed) comment and when it appears. Is there love afte. Thats how this tends to work. So many perps being exposed it looks like the Lord is behind the exposure. How to Resign from a Church Thanks Erp that is *very* helpful information! It never appeared that they were the type of people that would not speak up. Im not saying any of that is right. It is as if they are trying to saysee! This is church. People are observing us, day in and day out. Medical records are handled in this fashion. He could claim she was taking advantage of him (poor man) because she knew that after taking Ambien he might not be possessed of his full faculties for the rest of the night. I have going to professional society meeting for over 30 years, and hospitality suites are expected/ the norm. sigh. These things seem like nitpicking until you have more information. . Plausible deniability for Bill. Brad Brucker wrote: The woman alleging an affair with Bill said that she was suicidal, both to Leanne and to Bill. Why wait until now?? @ Davis and Natasha: Women get to decide if they want to be touched or not, and oh he did not mean anything by should never even have to be brought into play-in the workplace. The founding couple died, and the board got rid of those naughty kids and grandkids. This is about strange behavior which was tolerated because one guy knew how to build a church and bring in money. Not atypical. This is why I have posted the 1 Tim 5 passage in two threads recently: Just read what the Bible says about leaders and ask, Is it even possible that God would set these high standards for elders/overseers/pastors and then only give us promiscuous, abusive, and manipulative leaders?. In my opinion this is sufficient proof to logically and reasonably conclude that Bill Hybels is guilty of clergy sexual misconduct and adultery, over an extended period of time. It is the Spirits job to convict and change. A brave woman called each person out, which led to subsequent allegations, Differences I know, Ive been there. In the 1980s, she was the executive assistant to Bill Hybels, the senior pastor of Willow Creek Community Church. Fools a lot of people and so utterly against anything Christ said. I have Every year for many years OT once and NT twice- every year. This is not Christianity. Did we demand transparency? Abuse works on the good-hearted the ones who are trying to give others the benefit of the doubt, questioning their own discernment, seeking to extend charity. The Eleven and Jesus followers went on to be faithful in following their Lord in establishing the Church by the power of the Holy Spirit. We notice them! And with Invocation of GAWD subbing for the Ludes and Roofies. . I treated my childhood dog like a doll. Since you are well versed, go back to Jesus in the Garden the night he was betrayed. Read Paul on Mars hill. 21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe. Either way, doesnt matter. We still need to get together on that religious research thingie. Lydia, many have long suggested such things, but are officially scoffed at and rejected as conspiracists. Having seen some of the comments by WCC supporters left at TWW, I can imagine the pressure and pain that she has had to face with her account. The invitation to the first Family Meeting stated in the first paragraph that this group wanted to damage the church and the senior pastor! This story involved a fourteen-year sexual affair. Barb, I must say, you have this amazing gift of being able to cut through a persons (premeditated) bullpoo. You searched for: Author: lynne hybels bill I do not believe Jesus would have ever behaved the way you and John are acting. Its uncomfortable but is it anything really? The Aurora from TSO Photography on Vimeo. Get that through your heads. But it should not be celebrated, as Williams and Dummitt directly stated and indirectly did with continuous praises and accolades. Just to preface: I am a nobody and not a perfect saint. Woe to the one who quarrels with his Maker An earthenware vessel among the vessels of earth! We still need to get together on that religious research thingie. Ive told her about the many intelligent comments here! This is MBA stuff. 2) Its the cost of doing business as a very large or successful church . Willow Creek Community Church initially started as a high school ministry but grew over time to become one of the biggest Churches in the United . The video is on YouTube: Even the word Unity really means conformity. Bill Hybels and Willow Creek, Ravi Zacharias, Steve Timmis and Acts 29, Hillsong New York City pastor Carl Lentz, James MacDonald and Harvest Bible Chapel are just a few of the names I could list. No one wants to think their pastor is being inappropriate, so your brain just dismisses it. People not in the mega inner circle world dont understand it. Bill Hybels has stepped down. No one wants to think their pastor is being inappropriate, so your brain just dismisses it. 22 For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles, 24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. On the surface, an extended hug may seem harmless, even though deep down it creeps you out a little. Put a frog in a pot,with boiling water and the frog knows to jump out, but if the water is a slow boil, the frog with stay and finally be boiled. From what I understand Hybels had a history of handpicking Bible versus to pummel anyone who disagreed with him concerning church doctrine, etc Not surprising. So they fell in line with the One World system, befriended evil people and embraced Satans (the worlds) ways. Wild!!! You bet it will get nasty.. You see pastor do something and you know its off, but you rationalize it away I mustve misunderstood what was going on. Down the road, you something else, maybe far worse comes up, you think Oh, pastor, hes a little quirky, but he means well. You then experience something genuinely alarming, you think Well, hes an imperfect man, but God uses us all, no ones perfect.. Peter loved Jesus and responded in anger- causing physical harm to Malchus. Forgiveness after repentance is one thing (and a rare thing if someone never actually admits to anything beyond a mistakes in judgment were made public spin). Im unclear about what faith journey means, but it sounds very Willow Creek. They were forced to buy the package and become little Creekers in order to try and stay in the game. I think thats true for some and not others. Is it not I, the LORD? Ummm-not exactly. Ambien made me do it (Bill Hybels) @ Davis and Natasha: https://spiritualsoundingboard.com/2018/04/12/resource-bibliography-on-willow-creek-church-situation-and-bill-hybels-reported-misconduct/. If you note, the hotel rooms in these narratives were suites and meetings were being held in those rooms. This will sound horrible to some but I never understood the overall hug culture. Yet Ive made my point. Im probably talking to the air, though, because hit-and-run scolds like you seldom have the courage to come back. I stayed silent, but I now see that Im not alone. And ironically, asking that question is why. Hybels considers himself first among equals in the fraternity of evangelical pastors. I am quite curious what nonsense what posted now, because what?! And theres nothing fundamentally wrong with that in the proper context. Never being offended. At one mega, the pastors alleged other woman was the missions director. As for BIll HybelsI have not judged his salvation. WC is Hybels no matter how much they protest. Everything is about Conformity today. 1 kiss I hope that someone who knows what they are doing is archiving all of the official statements and documents by Hybels and WC. Im not convinced that his view of hell can be called heresy. Its all God this, God that, God God God. This is about strange behavior which was tolerated because one guy knew how to build a church and bring in money. Some more publicly than others. My team of outsourced profs, quality tech people saw it, too. Some will sadly never make the decision to follow Christ. Think carefully. Thank you for bringing this to everyones attention!! (Usually seeker Megas go with you are just human and made mistakes and not you are a worm so its to be expected. @ Thersites: Because his REAL Personal LORD and Savior (PASTOR Hybels) is getting Blasphemed. Forgiveness/ redemption for the sinner does not mean acceptance of the sin, nor does it mean deliverance from the consequences of the sin. The people there sold out to it will protect it at all costs. Lather, Rinse, Repeat, Lather, Rinse, Repeat, Lather, Rinse, Repeat, Pingback: Some Thoughts on Supposedly Feminist Men Who Reportedly Abuse/Harass Women | futuristguy. She also questioned her own judgment in whether he was actually being inappropriate. * Scripture does not discuss it that way. Are you really saying we would not judge anyone for anything? By . Assuming that Ms. Walle isnt lying whatever her tone or motives Ortberg could go first and model real manhood by addressing her claims directly, owning what is true, and asking for forgiveness, as warranted. Thats how they get by with it. To all those women that have been psychologically damaged, what a needless tradegy. The task is to not establish and maintain environments where such people can abuse without danger of being held accountable. Some people, educated people, decent people, never talked. Yet, if this person is free to say what was done by J Ortberg and offer her (non-intimidated, threatened) perspective on it, how can she conflate that with others coming forward to offer a perspective on their experience? We sat under their leadership at Willow Creek for several years and were sad when the Ortbergs left to California. It has been posted several times. I try to look for the patterns and tactics of the perps and their enablers. Bill has been married to Lynn Hybels since 1974. You were there (especially for children) I cannot find the comment so let me Some person, purportedly a woman, is blaming the women for going to Hybels hotel room. HE GOT AWAY WITH IT, SO CAN I! If it doesnt recur, people often try to dismiss it as an aberration. Celebrity is credibility in that world. who originally wrote plastic jesus - is lynne hybels still married to bill - is lynne hybels still married to bill That said, this is all so tragic. It alarmed me to learn that Nancy Ortberg was also the subject of Bill Hybels' unwanted attention and actions. She bears serious emotional scars to this day, several decades later. This will sound horrible to some but I never understood the overall hug culture. To TWW regulars: I am becoming concerned that there will be a full court press by some people. So, what led to the divorce? We still do not know what that really means. Hybels retired early from Willow Creek in 2018 after he was accused by several women, who worked for or attended the church, of sexual misconduct stretching back more than 20 years. Anybody who doesnt respect your boundaries, whatever they are, is suspect. If the 21st century church had the same healthy respect for a literal hell that the 1st century church had, we might behave differently in and out of church including church leaders! I informed my boss. I agree. Does Bill Hybel teach future pastors how to get their IT departments to have special deals? But is that truthful? i can not think of any good reason the pastor would want that! . How long are you going to allow Satan to control your actions? Once, while Mr. Hybels's wife, Lynne, and their children were away, the pastor took Ms. Baranowski out for dinner. And few of us agree on every point! https://futuristguymedia.wordpress.com/pyramid-of-abuse-and-culpability-complicity/. Lets go a little deeper. A quick glance at google and apparently hugging is drugging when it comes to the brain. _____________________________________. But, still I try not to broad brush. That is a big part of the problem. Too many missed opportunities to do the right thing. Second guessing somebodys way of dealing with their own spouse is usually really wrong. I refuse to answer the question How many people have you led to Christ? That question has no place in our discussions, Only in Christianese One-Upmanship My Piles Bigger Than Yours!. They are fighting for Hybels. AFAIK they havent yet made any corrections or denials. Or is this site simply about wholesale condemnation. Try finding a church now that sings traditional hymns or doesnt use projectors and worship teams. My heart goes out to you, all of you, by coming forward you have contributed to breaking this cycle of abuse. That was the exact thought I had while walking the dog this morning! Its not great for innovation. How they must love what they do! . But the church's growth also took a professional and personal toll on Hybels, who had married his. They have much easier prey in a church setting, as the sheep expect the shepherds to be godly, trustworthy and above such things as looking to get laid. Its the same thing my university wrings their hands over. In this day and age, no one wants to get their name caught in the tangled web. So much emphasis on good works at home & abroad, what about treating your brothers & sisters in leadership with respect that comes from a relationship w/ Christ. To control your actions forward you have contributed to breaking this cycle of abuse to! Among equals in the 1980s, she was the executive assistant to Bill large! You have this amazing gift of being held in those rooms wrong that. 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